Ornette in Victoria, 1958

[Gregg Simpson]

This picture of Ornette Coleman's group at the Scene in Victoria ca.1958 also has a piano player. Can anybody name him?

I thought it might be Paul Bley, but someone, like Gavin Walker, should see this photo which is from John Daws, trumpeter from the old Cellar years.

I'll bet he would know.

[John Dawe]

Hi Gregg..... I've just joined this site & this is the first chance I had to view this thing on Ornette.....where the heck did you get that foto?...the foto was mailed to me by Wally Lightbody abt a yr & half ago ...I don't recall giving a copy to anybody...funny how things travel about ha ha.....

Gregg, I'm (almost) 100% sure that foto was taken at the "Olde" Cellar & it probably was very late /57 ( not sure tho).....Wally very likley took it.

The piano player is Don Freidman from LA...can't remember the bass player at the moment...Gavin knows it tho....

I'm right now preparing to do a 'thing" on the orig. Cellar club & am now in the process of gathering together a large amount of fotos & have been getting some good responses from a lot of people that used to frequent the Cellar who now live out of town.

By-the-way, over the yearsI've run into a lot of info out there abt the Orig. Cellar & quite a bit is not too correct....I think that most of this is due to just "faulty memory syndrom".... & then this incorrect stuff gets passed around & it starts to grow "legs".....I'm hoping to clear alot of this stuff up if possible.

Best regards, Gregg ( & say Hi to my olde adversary (haha) , Al Neil for me , will ya)

John Dawe in sunny Richmond

[Brian Nation]

Welcome to the forum, John. You won't remember this but I met you once, many years ago. Jerry Deagle brought me by your place in the West End, I think it was. Not sure why I haven't seen you since. In any case, I'm looking forward to your contributions about the Cellar and other local jazz history.

[Gavin Walker]

Hey John,
Great to have you make the scene. Your presence will add to the website and for an old guy(smile) your memory is still in good shape. The bass player in Ornette's band is Ben Tucker(who wrote "Comin' Home Baby") and that shot was definitely at The Cellar. The drummer is of course Billy Higgins. Vancouver was Ornette's first out of town gig (he lived in L.A.) under his name. There was a half hour broadcast over NW or OR of this band but the recording has never been found.

[John Dawe]

Hi Brian....... Jerry WHO????....whoever he is I don't remember him...... but I sure remember you....you were wearing a pink hat with flowers on it....& fur galoshes... nothing much else as I recall....who could forget that getup.... nice disquise, Brian..... Jerry WHO???...... haha

HEEEYY. I'm just kidding....it's just the result of all those strange people I spent so much time socializing with at the OLDE PLACE.....like Dick Forrest, et al...... Al Neil was one of the straightest ones around back then compared to some others.......

Jerry WHO???

I've been layin low, & keeping out of gunshot range of "some" people.......
I think now I do remember you....was I sober?...... I think it was probably on a Wednesday...I was always home on Wed.

Hey nice to hear from you, Brian.....hope that I might be able to contribute a few things of interest to the site, maybe so...maybe not.......

I sincerely thank you for inviting me to the site..... (did I spell "site" right ????)

John Dawe in sunny Richmond

PS..... Jerry WHO ?????

[Nou Dadoun]

Originally Posted by John Dawe

The piano player is Don Freidman from LA...can't remember the bass player at the moment...Gavin knows it tho....

...
John Dawe in sunny Richmond

According to a posting on Doug Ramsey's Rifftides (http://www.artsjournal.com/rifftides...e_coleman.html), the bass player was Don Payne. Coincidentally, I just got Ben Tucker's email address in Georgia, I'll drop him a line to confirm it wasn't him ... N

[Gavin Walker]

For Ornette's visit and gig in Vancouver, the bassist WAS Ben Tucker but when the Jazz Messiahs came to the Cellar earlier in 1957 the band consisted of Don Cherry(trumpet an piano), James Clay (tenor), Don Payne (bass) and Billy Higgins(drums). Ornette's gig with Ben Tucker was later that year (1957) as confirmed by Dave Quarin. I called Dave about this, as I was there at both the Messiah's gig and Ornette's gig and the Globe and Mail wanted to do an article on Ornette to coinside with his Chan Centre gig. so I called Dave Q. to confirm the date etc. I remember the Messiah's gig as being in the summer as I didn't have to worry about being out on a school night and the Ornette gig was in the late fall (school nights). Dave confirmed the personnel and the date of Ornette's gig as November 1957. There was also an earlier appearance at the Cellar of the Messiah's with the legendary George Newman on alto but that was before my time in Vancouver (possibly late 1956). Dawe has a vague memory of that Messiah gig.