Questions about Vancouver Jazz

[Roach]

I'm just wondering if Vancouver is a place where there is a lot of Jazz going on.

Is Vancouver another cradle of Jazz just like New Orleans?

How important is Vancouver in the world of Jazz?

Is there any more detailed information or reference where I can find more information?

I appologize for my ignorance, it's just because I have to do a research on Jazz in Vancouver.

[Gregg Simpson]

Try the new Diana Krall biography by Jamie Reid (pages 62-67) for a great little history of jazz in Vancouver. Also Mark Miller's new book is a great source for information.

[Guy]

In an otherwise godawful book (Reid's biography of Krall, I'm talking about, not Miller's book, which I haven't read but have looked through and it looks good), those pages are okay. But still there are problems. Reid gets names wrong all over the place, although only a few times on these particular pages, like calling the Alma Street Cafe the Alma Cafe or calling the Hugh Fraser Quintet (Quartet, Trio, etc.) the Hugh Fraser Band (I'm quibbling here, but he did use caps for Band suggesting that's the name). He writes, "The Hugh Fraser Band ... often appears there." Uh, this book was written long after the Alma Street Cafe closed its doors. This gives the impression to the reader it's still active. But that's nothing compared to the following:

"TODAY [my caps], Vancouver CONTINUES [again, my caps] to support a handful of restaurants and clubs which feature mainstream jazz. Kenny Coleman [sic], an excellent crooner from the Frank Sinatra, Tony Bennett, and Mel Torme school IS [my caps] a regular at the downtown supper club called the Cave." !!!

Forget the fact that he chose Colman [note the correct spelling] to represent all the huge names that played the Cave over the years. The fact is, the legendary Cave has been closed for almost 20 years! Was it the research that was lacking or the editing? I have no idea. Either way it's an embarrassment. And to say, on page 65, that Veda Hille is a "jazz-oriented musician" is really stretching it.

This book was a total piece of junk from the first page (where he calls Django Reinhardt's group, the "Hot Five Club band" and says Stephane Grapelli [sic - can't he get a single name right?] was Belgian) to the last. I could go on and on, but why bother.

[This message has been edited by Guy (edited October 04, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by Guy (edited October 04, 2002).]

[Morgan Childs]

The best way to learn about jazz in Vancouver is to go out and hear the great musicians this city has to offer. If you haven't heard Campbell Ryga, Ross Taggart, Brad Turner, Blaine Wikjord, Bill Coon, Mike Allen, Ollie Gannon, Bruno Hubert etc etc... then you should get out there and take note: A lot of those musicians I just named have been playing professionally for longer than I've been alive. Some of them MUCH longer. THEY are the real history book on Vancouver jazz. Go to a gig and strike up a conversation, it's really the only way to understand how truly great our scene really is. When you hear some of the younger guys (Brad Turner, Ross Taggart, Jon Bentley, Bernie Arai etc...) talk about some of the staltwarts of the scene (Blaine, Hugh Fraser, Campbell etc) you start to understand that there is a culture of respect among younger musicians for the people that have been playing here for a long time, making some of the best music you're going to hear anywhere. Check it out. This website is a great place to start, to find out where the gigs are.

[Guy]

Or if you want to learn about the Vancouver scene even before the guys Morgan mentions, go see the WOW! Band at the Hot Jazz Club (Or Mainstream) on Tuesday nights. Guys like Stew Barnett, Paul Ruhland, and Jack Fulton were around in the 1950s and '60s, in the heyday of jazz in this town. And Jack Stafford, who probably arrived on the scene in the 1970s. Plus it's an amazing band -- and it's free!

[John Doheny]

Dear Roach,
Doheny will now open his big mouth and have a shot at answering your questions, in the order of their appearance.
1."Is Vancouver a place where there is a lot of jazz going on ?"
Compared to New York or New Orleans, no. But compared to Vancouver 10 years ago, Vancouver 2002 is doing pretty good, especially since the advent of the Cellar, which seems to have had a synergistic effect on the scene that goes far beyond the music happening in the club itself. Right on Cory!.( Incidentally THIS Cellar is the 3rd club that I know of to go by that name here. In the 50s, the original Cellar was located near Broadway and Main, in the alley off Watson St.That same location re-opened as the Cellar around 1970,I remember seeing Ornette Coleman and Charlie Haden there in 1971.And now Cory's place at Dunbar and Broadway).10 years ago your choices for live jazz would have been the Glass Slipper (sorely missed)the Alma Street Cafe( a lot of nights not much more than a piano bar) and the tuesday night jam session at Murphy's Pub.A quick look at the jazz calender on this web-site will show you how hugely things have improved since then.
2. "Is Vancouver another cradle of jazz just like New Orleans?"
No.
While I suppose an argument could be made that some of the work of Vancouver Avante Guardists, both past (Al Neill) and present ( NOW Orchestra, Francois Houle,Travis Baker,Coat Cooke et al)could be considered to represent a distinctive "Vancouver Style", the fact of the matter is that this place has never been a mover and shaker on the level of New York, Chicago or Los Angeles.New Orleans in the early 1900s was the equivalent of Mozart's 18th century Salzburg.Even now I'd say it has about 10 times the live music per capita(including straight-ahead jazz) that Vancouver does, because live music there is part of the mainstream municipal culture, not just some weird stuff for eggheads over in the corner that gets dragged out once or twice a year for a festival.The equivalent municipal culture in Vancouver is skiing,hiking, and shopping.
3."How important is Vancouver in the world of jazz?"
Sadly, not very. While some individuals and organizations(NOW Orchestra and VEJI, Hugh Fraser Quintet)have achieved international recognition, and the city has produced many world class players( Oliver Gannon, Fraser MacPherson,George Ursan,Ross Taggart, Brad Turner, Dennis Esson,Cam Ryga,Stan Taylor,Chris Gage...gee I could go on forever here and I'd still be leaving people out)an awful lot of really amazing players have found that they've had to move elswhere to have a life in music.Jerry Fuller, Seamus Blake, Rene Rosnes etc. are all players with international reputations who aren't really associated with Vancouver anymore.In fact ,I'm always kind of amazed that people like Brad Turner stay here, when they could clearly do better elsewhere.Vancouver is a very hostile city for musicians. Stupid liquour laws,restrictive zoning regulations,the U.S. border staring you in the face, the geographical isolation of the place and a population reluctant to go out and hear live music make Vancouver a very unattractive place for musicians in their 30s and 40s, the most productive years for many artists.Whoever said we have a much better artistic scene than we deserve was telling the truth.
For reference works I'd recommend " Jazz in Canada"(can't remember the author but it's in the main library),"Changes" by Al Neill, for a look at the bebop scene here in the 50s,and a good long talk over a couple of beers(you're buying)with any of the musicians who played places like the Cave and the Palomar back in the 50s and 60s when jazz and jazz related musics were still a part of popular culture in a way that they are so absolutely not, now.
Good luck in your research,
John S.P.Doheny
www.Johndoheny.com (http://www.Johndoheny.com)